This feels like a roomy library, nice and quiet, good for the mind. I am starting to think that even if we got more proof as regards to the fakery, perhaps we would still just be going after low level shills. Remember how Innocent Bystander was asking for the true factual history of Kucinich and the word "chemtrails" getting into a bill, or a draft of a bill? Well, the fake "believers" never really answered his question. So I think I have found interesting links on this subject which I am hoping you can help me out with, time permitting for you, I understand.
Okay, I will try to copy and paste the relevant stuff, so people won't feel they need to go chasing the links.
I went to google cache for this one from Megasprayer.
What really happened to HR2977?Surprise, surprise, Lord Reynolds got to post at chem11's place.
jay reynolds: It looks like it was a set-up all along:
animatedsoftware.com/cassini/cass2001/nks0003.htmCarol Rosin was an MKultra leftover, her history goes back to Tim Leary, she now heads up the nstitute for Cooperation in Space (ICIS), which wrote HR 2977.
In a classic bait/switch designed to demoralize chemtrail believers, chemtrails were listed in a bogus space weapons bill with no chance of getting out of committee, then yanked on the first day of a new session of congress.
chem11:
"In a classic bait/switch designed to demoralize chemtrail believers..."
But why the hell would anyone be interested in demoralizing chemtrail believers if said chemical trails didn't exist?
Answer: they wouldn't.
Why would Jay Reynolds offer such a theory if he didn't think there was something to it?
linkNukes, Kooks, and SpooksIssue #3, May 16th, 2000
From: Russell D. Hoffman, citizen activist
(former editor, STOP CASSINI newsletter)
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A BLANKET DENIAL:
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In a phone conversation last Saturday (May 13th, 2000), Carol S. Rosin used the word "slander" as descriptive of what I am saying about her and will continue to say.
I denied that any part of this is slander, explaining that I am simply telling what I have seen with my own two eyes, and that I have described and continue to describe precisely what I myself have experienced as a participant in the anti-nukes-in-space movement, and that I have speculated on the cause of such sick behavior, as I am free to do. For those reasons alone there is no slander here. But furthermore, working for the United States government is not a crime, and I believe that is, ultimately, who she works for. So to accuse me of slander is absurd, but yet she has used that word. She denies any and all charges that she is a spy of any sort, working in concert with Bruce Gagnon to destroy the anti-nukes-in-space movement, and the anti-weapons-in-space movement, and any individual activists who pose a threat in any way to the sanctity of the "system" they have created, a system which assures that nothing gets changed, and that the environmental laws written to protect us 30 years ago (which were utterly useless even when they were originally written) are not properly updated to the environmental considerations of the new millennium. The result of these efforts (which Rosin denies) is that the strength of all activists who might gain a foothold in the media and the public's eye, is systematically destroyed, and the individual is morally crushed and controlled, so that they will not accomplish anything significant in their lives.
And it's all not only perfectly legal to do this, but those who practice this voodoo art of manipulation are utterly unaware that what they are doing is the least bit immoral! They have forgotten the meaning of democracy.
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BACK AT YOU! (OR SO I'M WARNED):
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Carol S. Rosin further claims that I will appear suspicious if I denounce her, and that people will assume I am a spy because, she assures me the world believes, she couldn't possibly be. She says her friends will vouch for her. Then I say let them come forward and do so. Her husband stated to me on the phone the she is the most honest person he has ever met. (FYI, he is a professional actor.) As I heard someone say recently, "We're all crazy and none of us know how to act." (I wish I could remember who said it; I have literally met 500+ people in the last 6 weeks.)
I believe that my accusations will some day be proven correct, and for the sake of my pride and reputation, as well as for the sake of the need to find out what's wrong and fix it, I expect to be fully exonerated of any false charge against me. (Such as CSR has raised, namely, that it is I who is, in fact, the "spy" in our midst. Such an idea is truly preposterous, as I'm sure the CIA can tell you.)
Perhaps Rosin can collect more people today, and more famous people, than I can, in a famous-people-pissing contest, who will say she is right and I am wrong, but that will not constitute proof of anything. I am not in a popularity contest, but a search for basic, fundamental truths about democracy in America. Who's ruined the right of people to form fairly-run and honestly-guided environmental organizations, particularly those opposed to nukes in space? That's the question to be answered.
Perhaps Rosin's many friends will go out into the world, attempting to sway public opinion against me on her behalf. It will be too bad, but it won't matter. I know that I am fighting a fair battle, searching honestly for my foes before exposing and denouncing them, whether they work at NASA or pretend to be our friends, and I know that even though it may look like a dirty and mean fight to those unaccustomed to the depths of depravity to which our own government will stoop to conquer, it is, in fact, a "gentleman's war". I do not hate my enemy; they do not appear to hate me.
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HOWEVER:
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However, a person must be free to seek the truth, and I believe all activists should PICK A TOPIC and STICK WITH IT UNTIL THEY WIN.
That, I believe, is the only effective way to fight for anything. This NKS newsletter is nothing more than the natural followup to the STOP CASSINI newsletter, simply because this is the real reason Cassini could not be stopped. It was a lunatic idea supported by mad scientists and their lackeys. So how did it fail to be stopped? How did it fail to be investigated? How come most people still have never even heard of Cassini, despite the awesome threat to humanity which it posed, during launch in 1997 and especially, during its flyby of Earth in August, 1999?
The newsletter became an investigation into infiltrators who gain leadership positions within the movement against nukes in space, so I changed the name to Nukes, Kooks, and Spooks, and this is issue #3.
So far, for those keeping track, we have identified the following as dishonest infiltrators into various aspects of the anti-nuke movements: Carol Rosin, Regina Hagen and Bruce Gagnon (See NKS #3, #2, and #1, respectively, for the latest on these three clowns). Also a Catherine Euler in England (see Stop Cassini newsletter #190), and Alice Slater and Christa Rossner from GRACE (see SC newsletter #217). I personally believe Loring Werbil is too, though the data is still somewhat sketchy (see below for the latest information). Greenpeace, as an organization, is filled with spies. I believe all these people work for their respective governments, in a secret network, in conjunction with each other (not that all these people know each other, but they work for essentially the same group -- the Nuclear Mafia). All should be ignored and if you do deal with them you should do the exact opposite of whatever they want you to do to stop the destruction of planet earth by nuclear waste -- unless it happens to be a good idea, in which case do it, but even then, never think that it is enough. It won't be.
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THESE PEOPLE ARE NOT OUR FRIENDS:
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So anyway, I go to Wikipedia.
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carol_RosinDr. Carol Sue Rosin (b. March 29, 1944 in Wilmington, Delaware) is an award-winning educator, author, leading aerospace executive and space and missile defense consultant. She is a former spokesperson for Wernher von Braun and has consulted to a number of companies, organizations, government departments and the intelligence community. She is the current President of the Institute for Cooperation in Space (ICIS) which she co-founded with Alfred Webre. Dr. Rosin has received the support of various prominent individuals such as U.S. Congressman Dennis Kucinich [1][2], and Hon. Paul Hellyer, a former Canadian Minister of National Defence. She is also a witness for The Disclosure Project. [3]
Fairchild Industries
Dr. Rosin was the first woman to hold the position of Corporate Manager at Fairchild Industries[3] from 1974 through 1977, where she met the late Dr. Wernher von Braun. When they first met in early 1974, Von Braun was dying of cancer. [4] According to Rosin's accounts, Von Braun spent the last years of his life explaining to her his position that space-based weapons are dangerous, destabilizing, too costly, unnecessary, and unworkable, and explaining the available alternatives. [4] He asked Dr. Rosin to be his spokesperson and to appear on occasions when he was too ill to speak. [4] According to Rosin, he also asked her to take on the challenge of promoting the ban of space weapons by educating decision makers and the grassroots about transforming the military industrial complex into a peaceful space exploration industry. [4]
According to Rosin, von Braun also spoke of the existence of "off planet cultures" (extraterrestrials) and government conspiracies to keep the existence of them a secret. [4][5]
Space weapons consultant
Dr. Rosin has been a consultant to corporations and organizations, including TRW, Disney, GE, IBM and the National Space Institute on space and defense. She has testified before the U.S. Congress, the U.S. Senate, the President's Commission on Space and has met with people in over 100 countries about the feasibility of banning space-based weapons.
Current life
She is the founder and former director of the Institute for Security and Cooperation in Outer Space (ISCOS), an NGO in consultative status with the United Nations Economic and Social Counsel (UN-ECOSOC). [6]
She co-founded the Institute for Cooperation in Space (ICIS) in 2001 and is the current President. The ICIS board is made up of various prominent individuals such as former astronauts Edgar Mitchell & Dr. Brian O'Leary, as well as Arthur C. Clarke, General Council Daniel Sheehan and John McConnell who is the founder of International Earth Day. [6]
She currently lives in Vilcabamba, Loja, Ecuador. [6][7] She co-owns a hotel in Vilcabamba named Madre Tierra where she focuses on wildlife conservation, the study of organic foods and remedies as well as negative ions. [8]
Dr. Rosin has received the Space Humanitarian Award in 2000 from the United Societies in Space for her 30 years of dedication on the subject[9], a Science Teachers Gold Medal Award, an Aviation Writers Award and an American Society of Engineering Educators Award for organizing the motivation program "It's Your Turn" for youth, women and minorities. [10]
To cut to the chase, somehow I end up at this blog, called "Kucinich, Chemtrails and HR 2977". For some reason I don't see the author's name, and yikes, I rattled off an e-mail to the person thinking we might have found a real person. Just a glance at the website made me think this could be a good find. But uh oh, I now see it is a debunker palace.
Ugh, I wrote and sent this before even checking out the blog. This could be Jay Reynolds himself.
Dude, I cannot believe you wrote this about a week ago. I am someone who has been {humbly} looking deep into chemtrails for about two years. Somehow I ended up at this same story, just after yourself. It's funny, a few weeks ago I wrote a post that included chemtrail central discussion of Kucinich and the space preservation bill.
Sorry I don't have more to say. I just started a new forum. If you check it out please don't let what is there now scare you.
The scariest part for me is one link I just read saying that for activists to succeed, they must stick to one issue until they win. The writer was saying that Rosin was an alphabet product. Actually, I found some old thread with a Jay Reynolds posting at a place called Megasprayer. That's what led me to your blog.
Anyway, my initial thought is this. Why would "chemtrails" be put into even a draft of a bill {I'm not sure exactly what happened}, why do that if chemtrails is a crazy internet hoax, that chemtrails are contrails?
Thanks, I actually haven't read your paper yet. It looks good. I am glad to have found this website and am looking forward to checking this place out.
Thanks for your time, "socrates"
Anyway, this blog was found at
contrail science.
Kucinich, Chemtrails and HR 2977
One of the more pervasive myths regarding “chemtrails” is that current presidential candidate Dennis Kuchinich tried to have them banned by an act of congress, but was pressured by the government to modify the act to remove mention of “chemtrails”.
So what really happened? In a nutshell, Kucinich did not write the bill (or read it, until too late), the focus of the bill is nothing to do with chemtrails, it was written by UFO enthusiasts trying to: nullifying a conspiracy by the “military-industrial complex”, allow the use of suppressed alien technology, and avoid accidentally shooting down visiting aliens. They listed a bunch of weird weapons, including mind control, tectonic weapons and chemtrails. The bill was re-written several time in less crazy language to give it chance of passing, but ultimately fizzled in committee.
The specific act was HR 2977, the “Space Preservation Act of 2001″, the stated goal of which was:
To preserve the cooperative, peaceful uses of space for the benefit of all humankind by permanently prohibiting the basing of weapons in space by the United States, and to require the President to take action to adopt and implement a world treaty banning space-based weapons.
The initial version of the act is the only one that makes mention of “exotic weapons systems”, listing several technologies that will be familiar to conspiracy theorists:
(i) electronic, psychotronic, or information weapons;
(ii) chemtrails;
(iii) high altitude ultra low frequency weapons systems;
(iv) plasma, electromagnetic, sonic, or ultrasonic weapons;
(v) laser weapons systems;
(vi) strategic, theater, tactical, or extraterrestrial weapons; and
(vii) chemical, biological, environmental, climate, or tectonic weapons.
Yes, it even includes “extraterrestrial weapons”, meaning weapons created by aliens (or created from alien technology from crashed flying saucers at Roswell), as well as psychotronic (mind control) weapons. Yet somehow “chemtrails” gets all the attention here.
Who wrote this? The original language for the bill was actually created by an organization called the “Institute For Cooperation In Space“, an organization whose primary purpose is to promote adoption of the Space Preservation Act. The ICIS states on its web site in part:
Humanity is on the threshold of a quantum leap in consciousness and endeavor.We must now take action to preserve this grand opportunity by preventing the weaponization of space.
We have a critical choice – to explore the great unknown of outer space or to risk continued suffering and disasters, devastation or obliteration. We can rise above different perspectives and actions that didn’t, don’t, and won’t cause second order change, actions that recognize our high consciousness and human potential applied with out-of-the-box thinking and intention to cause second order change, or we can continue the status quo of protesting the old and accepting the same that would only lead us to more violence instead of peace.
The whole site has a very “new-age” feel to it. Seemingly if only this act is passed, the military-industrial complex will turn from its warlike ways, and humanity will enter a new age of cooperation, progress and raised consciousness. The rationale for a weapons ban is never clearly explained. Nor is it explained why having weapons in space will prevent normal research and exploration of space. Obviously we would all like to see less deadly weapons floating over our heads, but is a total ban vital to the next stage of human evolution? ICIS seems to think so.
Indeed, when you talk about things in simple terms, an “international ban on weapons in space” sounds like a great idea. Like a ban on chemical weapons, it saves money and makes the world a safer place. So it’s not hard to get people to support such a ban.
The face of the ICIS, is Carol Rosin, who, together with co-founder Alfred Webre, was the architect of the original version of the bill. Back Rosin claims that in 1974 rocket scientist Werner Von Braun told her “Carol, you will stop the weaponization of space”, and described to her a vast conspiracy by the military-industrial complex to raise a series of fears to justify space-based weapons. Since then, Rosin has dedicated her life to exposing this conspiracy, and allowing humanity to expand it’s consciousness into space. Here’s a video of her explaining this.
The video shows Rosin speaking at “The Disclosure Project“, an organization working to “disclose the facts about UFOs, extraterrestrial intelligence, and classified advanced energy and propulsion systems.” Rosin herself only briefly touches on this in her speech, but it is clear she believes that the government has alien technology, and is withholding it from the people.The other board members on the ICIS are co-founder Alfred Webre, Brian O’Leary and Daniel Sheehan, all of whom are deeply involved with The Disclosure Project.
So what’s Kucinich’s involvement in this? It’s difficult to say. Kucinich is anti-war, so perhaps that’s his motivation. He does have a lot of new-age, UFO-believing, friends, but he’s also running for president. When he was made aware of the nature of the “exotic weapons” language in the bill, it was re-written, and when questioned about it, he said
I’m not into that. Understand me. When I found out that was in there, I said, ‘Look, I’m not interested in going there.’
If you actually ARE a conspiracy theorist, then all this will come as little surprise to you. You will already believe the government is covering up technology based on crashed UFOs. Yet HR2977 is constantly being mentioned solely to make the case that “chemtrails” are something the government is aware of. The reality is that they were simply given a passing mention in bill written by new-age UFO conspiracy theorists, who believe in things that are far more unusual than “chemtrails”.
Saturday 19 May 2007
There's a line from Austin Powers, "What does it all mean, Basil?"
